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Gnoes
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38
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The Netherlands
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Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 12:59 pm
Post subject: Google Ban & The Buzz
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Not only are 85 of 90 of James 1st-in- sites now gone, also the Buzz blew up last week. A few more weeks like these and his entire (public) empire is up in vapors! Who could have believed this half a year ago!
James could've done a lot of damage control by being honest with his students. In August he merely glossed over the problem of his 40-something sites being banned. And in the latest Buzz there is nothing but a cosy chat on a Google ban of one of his sites back in 2001 and how much he learned from it. But nothing on the present-day troubles. The entire rest of this Buzz was filled with general-, often small-talk, not worth 10 bucks a month. The only explanation he has given us on the Christmas bannings has not been very forthcoming either: | Quote: | So I suspect sabatoge, for the reasons mentioned above and for one other I am not going to get into.
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(his posting elsewhere on this forum)
He has always been looking for the causes offsite, even as we all know outside causes are hardly ever to blame for a banning. His conduct the last few weeks shows me that James is not willing to further lead the troops. It is really a shame. I've come to like and respect the man over time, but he is losing credibility as a teacher really fast now. What reason could he have for not being straightforward with us? Since all his new sites are out of sight by now, there is no risk of plagiarism or sabotage anymore. I could've understand cautiousness in the past with his sites for everyone to see. But I don't understand his reluctance to share now. Except if he did something really bad and stupid with the 1st-in sites. Or he has not thought through this and the effect it has on his teaching-business-model.
I hope it's the latter and he will change his mind very soon!
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Gnoes
Last edited by Gnoes on Sat Jan 22, 2005 4:10 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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esteneker
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Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 2:25 pm
Post subject: I shar ne your feelings
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Gnoes,
I think many were eagerly awaiting his response on the latest buzz, but so far his recent predicament is buzzing everywhere except on the buzz (pun intended).
Personally, I don't think that the 'James Martell' method of building sites has anything to do with the ban. But that's not the issue. Keeping such a low profile when one's credibility is questioned (some may even call it 'ducking') is not good business practice.
His latest buzz should (IMHO) have gone in-depth on this issue. In fact, I'm extremely puzzled why a clever business man (as I see Mr. Martell) is ignoring this chance to debunk this questioning of his credibility.
Just my 2 cents.
Erwin.
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MakeMoney
Joined:
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119
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Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 3:26 pm
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I don't understand why he doesn't just ask google why his sites have been removed (and then let us know), or if there is a malicious outside cause (people duplicating his content or some kind of redirection trick), why not get google to correct the unfair banning (removal from index) and get his so many sites reindexed and pr'ed?
I'm sure if he called them they would tell him directly why all those sites were banned.
Last edited by MakeMoney on Sat Jan 22, 2005 4:43 pm; edited 3 times in total |
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speedguide
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Palm Coast, Florida
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Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 4:08 pm
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Please forgive me if I offend anyone...
As I've read the post I get this feeling that everyone thinks James is "hiding" something. Just as testing things takes a while so does finding out the cause of a drop from the google index.
The bottom line IS NOT PR or a LISTING in GOOGLE. It's what your sites generate in revenue.
Example: If you were making $500 on the web from all your sites listed in google, yahoo and MSN with a google PR of 4 and by magic google drops you from the index and your revenue dives to $496 per day... would you get on the phone to google. Would you question your "methods"? Would you think you need to tell everyone why the sky is falling?
I'm not saying James knows or not. He may be searching as to why. His income may in fact went up. I don't know.
I do know that "throwing" accusations will not improve your site. What can you do today to give yourself a pay raise.
If he's not in google anymore it's one less site you need to compete with in that niche.
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Gary
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MakeMoney
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Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 4:26 pm
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| Part of the attraction many had to this course were the high ranking sites in google that was promoted with the course. So I think it is natural for people to have this discussion, wondering what happened. |
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John Lenaghan
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Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 4:43 pm
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I haven't been too concerned about this situation for a couple of reasons. First, none of the sites that I have built following the "Martell Method" have been banned from Google. That tells me that it isn't the system that James teaches that is at fault here.
The other reason is a lot of his 1st-in sites did not follow his system to the letter. He could have been testing any number of things that might have caused him to get on the wrong side of Google. I'm pretty sure his top priority is his affiliate "empire" - not his training manual - so I would be pretty surprised if he wasn't trying new things on a regular basis.
As a student of James', I don't think he owes me an explanation unless something in the method he teaches in the manual turns out to be wrong.
In regards to the Affiliate Buzz site problem, the last issue of the Buzz would have been recorded well before that so it wouldn't have been a problem at that point. I expect we'll hear more about that in the next one.
That, of course, is just my opinion...YMMV 
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speedguide
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Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 4:52 pm
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MakeMoney,
Agreed... however, google isn't the only SE we need to keep our eyes on. Google gives us all an easy way to see PR, back links and such. You need to look at James' eBook as a "system". Google is only one component for the system. A very good component but one he has no control over. The same can be said for Yahoo and MSN.
Now if his sites dropped from ALL SE's when we have something to talk about.
James' formula or system is still valid. It's really the same as SBI in my opinion.
Let me present a different question then to the problem.
James says nothing... what will you do with your sites, business plan, approach, etc. That's the real question. What are you doing today to improve your sites, content, ranking, click thrus, etc... regardless of what James' response is?
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MakeMoney
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Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 5:04 pm
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I think James is a great guy and I'm sure he has sites doing well in google. I know he does - I've believe I've spotted some
But I think it is natural for people to ask. People want to know how to avoid that penalty. I think people are just curious even if it was nothing with the technique itself that caused the problem - like what did he do to get into that much trouble - or if it is nothing he did - what to watch out for.
Last edited by MakeMoney on Sat Jan 22, 2005 5:15 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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speedguide
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Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 5:10 pm
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MakeMoney,
I know some if his new sites are doing well. And the method hasn't changed!
Keep creating quality content and you'll be fine.
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Gary
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Gnoes
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Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 5:41 pm
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Hi Speedguide,
Come on, being properly indexed in Google is very important. If you're thrown off, it will cost you at least 30% traffic; and revenue. That is in your example down from 500$ to 350$ a day (not to 496$ a day).
And if it's a new Google algoritm, then this year Yahoo, whose algoritm lags approx. 1 year behind will be next, there goes another 30-40% revenue. And you think you'd still have a healthy business?
The past 2 years we, the students, were to follow him by the book. 8 Steps with a lot of baby steps. And now we apparently see his whole business in jeopardy. You think it's strange that, since we don't seem to hear from James, we discuss the causes and the effects?
I am not accusing James of anything, I just would like him to go in depth on what happened.
How come you know some of his new sites? I wouldn't think of telling my friends any url's if I were afraid of sabotage, as James says he is. Especially not if I were in his position. And I also would make sure nobody could find them through queries.
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Last edited by Gnoes on Sat Jan 22, 2005 6:19 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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robertb
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Columbus, OH
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Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 6:18 pm
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| speedguide wrote: | | Please forgive me if I offend anyone... |
I was trying to ignore this all Gary, but look, you've dragged me into it!
| Quote: | | That is in your example down from 500$ to 370$ a day (not to 496$ a day). |
All Gary was trying to point out is Google isn't everything; it's the bottom line that matters. How well can you convert to the traffic you're getting. I have both sites that do well in Google only, and do well in Yahoo only. We're not in any position to tell which of James sites did well in which; and how his revenue has changed.
| Quote: | | You think it's strange that, since we don't seem to hear from James, we discuss the causes and the effects? |
I don't think Gary said that at all. From what I can tell, all he meant was to worry about things that are within your control, period. It is perfectly alright to discuss what happened to James, no one is saying it isn't; but focus your time and effort on things that can build and grow your business.
James method in his MANUAL still works, or you'd hear about all of his student's sites failing.
| Quote: | | How come you know some of his new sites? |
Just because you don't know of them, doesn't mean no one else does. Gary is a good friend of James, he's been mentioned in the BUZZ a couple times as well.
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speedguide
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467
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Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 6:37 pm
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Gnoes,
| Quote: | | Come on, being properly indexed in Google is very important. If you're thrown off, it will cost you at least 30% traffic; and revenue. That is in your example down from 500$ to 350$ a day (not to 496$ a day). |
I never said not being properly indexed in google wasn't important. The numbers I gave were just as an example. Google COULD account for ZERO percent of his traffic or 70%. The point I was making is -- your revenue is what's important. Not your listing or your PR.
| Quote: | | And if it's a new Google algoritm, then this year Yahoo, whose algoritm lags approx. 1 year behind will be next, there goes another 30-40% revenue. And you think you'd still have a healthy business? |
The algorithm takes in dozens of factors you could rank great in google and stink in yahoo and vice-versa.
| Quote: | The past 2 years we, the students, were to follow him by the book. 8 Steps with a lot of baby steps. And now we apparently see his whole business in jeopardy. You think it's strange that, since we don't seem to hear from James, we discuss the causes and the effects?
I am not accusing James of anything, I just would like him to go in depth on what happened. |
It's possible he's still sorting it out before he makes any statements or corrections. It's also possible what he has stated is EXACTLY what you should do and he "tested" some things that spanked him. Things he never recommended but wanted to try out. And they back fired.
James like most marketers continues to test things. You won't hear him say much until he's pretty sure what the issue is.
| Quote: | | How come you know some of his new sites? I wouldn't think of telling my friends any url's if I were afraid of sabotage, as James says he is. Especially not if I were in his position. |
I sat in a presentation he gave. Your friends aren't the ones to worry about... If they are... get some new friends. And your are correct. I wouldn't and will not give out the URL's.
robertB... just caught your post... we're on the same page.
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Gary
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Gnoes
Joined:
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Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 7:43 pm
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When everything went well Google rankings were everything with Work at Home Net Guides! Now 85 sites are down the google-drain and the importance of Google rankings is downplayed at the same time and just as easily by either personnel or personal friends of James.
And you want the students to be believe you?
Have a look at Alexa; 1st-in- traffic is going down across the board on almost every site.
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speedguide
Joined:
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Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 8:04 pm
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Gnoes,
No question Google has been an important place to point for success. However, I'll make the point in a different way and stop. I have a site with a PR 5+ and it was never built for revenue. In fact if I make $50 per month I would be surprised.
I have another site at with a great PR2 that brings in about $25 per day.
I just focus on what I can control .... and it ain't google or yahoo or msn.
I'll just agree to disagree.
All the Best,
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Gary
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esteneker
Joined:
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Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 8:21 pm
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Hi All,
What I find strange is that James Martell's credibility is questioned, and he has a channel to confront that (the Buzz), yet he doesn't use it...
Personally, I'm not questioning his method, I see absolutely no harm in it.
But I can remember that Dutch multinational Unilever had to scrap a product with a billion dollar development price tag (Omo Power), just because they didn't quickly and adequately confront credibility attacks by a competitor.
Regards,
Erwin.
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