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Phil Tanny
Joined:
22 Aug 2003
Posts:
1324
Location:
Gainesville Florida USA
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Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2005 9:50 pm
Post subject: Some Success
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Hey, this is getting fun. Not being very experienced with SEO I really had little idea how long it would take for the pagerank of my new site to show up, or what it would be when it did.
My impression was it might take months to see results, so even though my site is a month old now, I hadn't checked my PR until today. PR4 with 300 some incoming links.
I'm not sure really how good that is in the broad scheme of things, but for the moment I've decided to celebrate.
And there's a lesson here that needs to be pounded in to my head. Pound, pound, pound! Last week the site had a minor tech burp. But it didn't seem minor at the time as I'd been working too hard too many days in a row. And it seemed like the press I was getting wasn't working too well. I wasn't getting instant success, so I should just quit and die, right? 
Wrong, wrong, wrong of course. Now matter how old one is, the same lessons often must be learned over and over. Sigh...
Finally took a day off, came home to PR4, the beers are on me. 
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Adam Murray
Joined:
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50
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Posted: Mon Jan 10, 2005 11:47 pm
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Hey Phil,
I'm also from the gainesville, fl area... congrats on your first PR 4 rating and especially the 300 incoming links. 300 is quite good actually for incoming links. Gathering incoming links is where most people struggle. Congrats!
-Adam |
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Superpreneurs.com
Joined:
06 Oct 2004
Posts:
146
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Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2005 12:21 am
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With incoming links and PageRank, it's something that doesn't show up right away - it doesn't change until Google "dance" (update). Not sure if it's the same with the EFFECTS of the PR (ie. increased SE Rankings) or just the PageRank itself - but you won't see concrete improvements until the next Google dance.
For all you who think you're "getting nowhere".
-Dan |
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robertb
Joined:
09 Aug 2003
Posts:
1837
Location:
Columbus, OH
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Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2005 3:33 am
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The PR we see in the toolbar is updated quarterly now (so it seems), but Google is constantly updating their internal PR with your new backlinks all the time. No big dance required.
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Superpreneurs.com
Joined:
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146
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Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2005 4:46 am
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| Thanks Robert, have been curious about that. |
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Phil Tanny
Joined:
22 Aug 2003
Posts:
1324
Location:
Gainesville Florida USA
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Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2005 7:29 am
Post subject:
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Go Gators Adam!
It seems my PR is based entirely on the links. I haven't done any SEO at all yet, not even meta tags, and there's not that much content on the site.
I should also mention I'm not getting any significant traffic from the search engines yet, so if I don't keep working at it, PR4 doesn't mean much. In the niche of this site PR4 isn't going to be enough to make me a star.
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AllanGardyne
Site Admin
Joined:
02 Jul 2003
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6326
Location:
by the beach, Australia
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Posted: Wed Jan 12, 2005 9:32 pm
Post subject:
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Congratulations! Great start.
You could consider developing the site into the one place to go for any information at all on links and linking. That would provide lots of fodder for the search engines to feed on, and give people lots of reasons to provide free links to you.
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Allan Gardyne
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Phil Tanny
Joined:
22 Aug 2003
Posts:
1324
Location:
Gainesville Florida USA
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Posted: Wed Jan 12, 2005 10:00 pm
Post subject:
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Yes, great point Allan. I've begun this, in a very modest way so far.
I'll admit I'm a bit indecisive on it though.
On one hand having this experience is teaching me the power of linking like no forum thread could, and naturally I'm interested in developing my linking skills further.
On the other hand, my real reason in building the site was not to create yet another webmaster portal, but to develop a large list of willing linkers who know and trust me, so that it would be easier to get links for sites on more niche topics.
It's a time management issue really, as I'd enjoy doing both.
And to be really honest, it's not clear to me whether recip linking is a subject with a big future. Don't have a fixed opinion, just not sure.
Part of my experience over the last month has shown me how powerful linking really is, and another part of my experience has shown me that there is a "reciprocal linking is dead" movement afloat in the web culture.
My best guess is that this movement comes mostly from SEO writers needing something new to say, now that they've all written 1,000 articles on how important it is for all of us to find link partners. One can't position oneself as cutting edge writing that article anymore. I've fallen in this trap myself, right here on this board.
I now believe that recip linking is like any other web technique, it can be done well or poorly. To say "recip linking is dead" because some people do it poorly is like saying we shouldn't read Allan's newsletter because some people spam.
Nonetheless, fads are fads and have a life of their own. I'm unclear as to how much energy I want to invest in swimming against this tide.
All that said I'm days away from releasing a new site on a related topic that I hope will pull more webmasters in to Links-For-You.
The suspense is unbearable... not really!
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AllanGardyne
Site Admin
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6326
Location:
by the beach, Australia
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Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2005 1:21 am
Post subject:
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I wonder if one of your major challenges with your links site is that you chose a name which is similar to the name of an often criticized links exchange site. I just checked - that site now has a PageRank of zero, so it's looks as though it has been penalized by Google.
Perhaps some people are confusing your site with the other site.
One quick, small step you could take in removing confusion and enhancing your image: Add "Phil Tanny" to your signature file on this forum, and everywhere else you use it.
Anyone who has come to know you over the years you've been online knows you work hard to provide only high quality, useful stuff. I reckon you should work harder to make the most of that good reputation and build on it.
You can trust Phil Tanny. He's one of the good guys.
Feel free to quote me.
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Charlie
Joined:
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Posts:
3305
Location:
UK
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Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2005 1:54 pm
Post subject:
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Hello Phil.
| Phil Tanny wrote: | | All that said I'm days away from releasing a new site on a related topic that I hope will pull more webmasters in to Links-For-You. |
It's good to see the PR is up, but considering how competitive this sort of area is, have you considered giving the right people an incentive to mention your service?
The concept is good, but how about thinking of a way to brand or incentivise it in some way, so people with influence are more likely to recommend it to others rather than just use it themselves?
[ How's that for subtle preselling? ]
Considering you have a DB set up, adding a brandable aspect shouldn't be too difficult. "What's in it for them" can't be emphasised enough in competitive niches, I reckon.
SE traffic for low competition areas; affiliate-like partnerships for the other extreme.
Just my opinion,
Charlie.
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Phil Tanny
Joined:
22 Aug 2003
Posts:
1324
Location:
Gainesville Florida USA
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Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2005 3:23 pm
Post subject:
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Thanks _much_ for the input guys! A lot of interesting
thread material here. Please pardon me if I go on too
much about my own site, I'll try to keep the discussion
more generally useful.
Yes, the name of the site was a blunder, I see that now.
Research is just one of many things I stink at...
Allan, thanks as always for your vote of confidence. You
are a _patient_ and generous fellow, and a role model
for me.
Yes, I agree personalizing the presentation will help,
for those who reach the site hoping to be sold.
I had a useful conversation just yesterday with a fellow who
politely and constructively suggested my site triggered his "link
farm some sort of scam" cynical buttons. He suggested bold
headlines and compelling ad copy as the solution. Sigh...
Use the source of market wide cynicism as the cure??
No thanks.
But the experience was educational in that I watched as
a real conversation with a real person brought him around
to at least realize it wasn't a scam trick gimmick thing.
So, my picture on the home page, with a link to a forum
where I answer questions, would likely help with those
who visit the site, but still have doubts. It won't help
with those (the overwhelming majority) who read the review
in a newsletter and dismiss it out of hand.
Allan gave the site a _wonderful_ review. 20,000 readers
read it, 50-100 signed up. 19,990+ readers passed.
I got 2 article length posts in the (get ready for the name of
this ezine) Link Exchange Digest. That goes to 50,000
webmasters. Twice. Maybe a dozen signups or so.
My mistake, which I've made repeatedly on many fronts
throughout my life, is to take literally things that people
say. If I read 1,000 posts that say, "I wish there was
an easier way to get link partners" I believe it literally,
not seeing the counter currents.
So I agree, when I can personalize and talk to people one
on one I can make the sale. But is it worth it to swim
against this tide? Undecided. I've been doing a lot of
swimming against the tide in my Net career, it gets
tiresome.
I think Allan's suggestion of creating a lot of content,
and getting search engine traffic is as close to a solution
as there is, and it's worth a try. Connect with those
who are ready, when they are ready. I have to automate
the marketing somehow, or give it up.
Charlie, yes, Allan and I have explored the incentive idea.
The original design of the site gave all the ad income the
site made to the inlinking members.
I'm now contemplating a 2 tier affiliate program run by
a text link selling company. I can use this to
make my members incoming links money makers, for both of us.
But I think you mean, provide incentives to ezine publishers
and big sites? Any ideas on how I can give more to them,
without making it not worth it for me in the process?
I'm listening!
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Charlie
Joined:
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UK
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Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2005 3:45 pm
Post subject:
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| Phil Tanny wrote: | But I think you mean, provide incentives to ezine publishers
and big sites? Any ideas on how I can give more to them,
without making it not worth it for me in the process? |
One way would be to write (or otherwise acquire) a useful report that you could present to everyone who subscribed to your service...
This could be sponsored by and/or be branded with the affiliate links of the referrer.
For example, in the case of your links tool, you could write a report on the importance of a natural incoming links structure (say) and then include affiliate links for Planet Ocean or whatever.
If you could think of an obscure but excellent two tier program, you could
even get people to sign up under you.
This could all be offered to anyone who registers. I'm sure you can think of a suitable backend monetisation opp for your own piggy bank!
Food for thought, I hope.
Cheers,
Charlie.
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rlray216
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Phil Tanny
Joined:
22 Aug 2003
Posts:
1324
Location:
Gainesville Florida USA
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Posted: Sat Jan 15, 2005 11:41 am
Post subject:
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Thanks Charlie. Signup bonus, nice, I hadn't thought of that yet. Appreciate it.
I took Allan's idea and solicited testimonials from my users yesterday. Will put his on the home page, with a link in to the others. Great plan!
Thanks guys!
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Charlie
Joined:
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Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2005 3:26 pm
Post subject:
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| Phil Tanny wrote: | | Thanks Charlie. Signup bonus, nice, I hadn't thought of that yet. Appreciate it. |
Remember, the point was to get other people to promote it, rather than "just" make the package more attractive to the buyer.
Cheers,
Charlie.
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