Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 11:19 am Post subject: Do it by the book, or don't do it at all...
Hello again.
AllanGardyne wrote:
I built my first affiliate site in 1996 using raw, hand-coded HTML, and I wasted months and months fiddling with it, reading articles, visiting other web sites, copying bits of HTML coding and fiddling with it to see what would happen. At times I ended up with pages that looked OK in Internet Explorer but not in Netscape, or vice versa. I didn't really have a clue what I was doing in those days.
Things were different then. Most people had to learn the hard way, as there wasn't anywhere near the level of published expertise (or anything else) as there is now. In those days a bit of techie know-how was at least as important as marketing excellence. Doing business online (certainly outside the US) was more novelty than anything.
Nowadays the competition is much stiffer, and marketing skills are much more important than tech-related ones. But equally there is a lot of good advice out there, if you want to do things your own way.
Planet Ocean for the SEs, for example. And let's not forget the rest of the pre-SBI! SiteSell product range...
What's happened to all these? I have most of these forgotten classics! But these days, it seems as though it's only the SBI! tail that wags the SiteSell dog!
My point (at last) is that, with hindsight, if I was starting again now, I wouldn't scrabble around with free information, I'd spend a few more dollars on a few sources of true quality info, and speed the process up considerably. Wouldn't you, too, Allan?
However good it is, SBI! is just one method.
Allan once said how important he thought it was to run your business the way you want to, rather than how everyone else says it should be done. Much as I respect Ken Evoy's achievements, I reserve the right to agree with Allan!
AllanGardyne wrote:
And then I started trying to optimize it for search engines - so I did things back to front. You need to be thinking about search engines right from the first day.
Planet Ocean springs to mind again (see above). That and the (free) SBI! user guide (see below).
AllanGardyne wrote:
In total contrast, it's been fascinating watching my assistant Rupert as he's worked his way through the Site Build It! Action Guide, researching profitable keywords, and then concentrating on writing useful, helpful, interesting articles.
Almost all his focus has been on the important stuff, the things that get good results, the things that earn revenue.
At the risk of being "jack of all trades", SBI! does at least try to cover most things. However, to succeed, you seem to need to follow the method exactly. Rupert had the advantage of Allan as mentor/motivator, forever keeping him to the "true path".
Judging by the results many people are getting, it seems to me they have not even read the guide, let alone put it into practise. Their sites reflect this. They probably do not have someone like Allan (with a strong interest in their success) looking over their shoulder!
It's almost as if SBI! is best suited to "employees", but targeted at entrepreneurs. From my experience, quelling "entrepreneurial flair" doesn't exactly help overcome procrastination either. At least not for certain independent minded people.
AllanGardyne wrote:
He didn't believe he'd be able, as a complete newbie, to achieve No.1 and No.2 rankings in Google, but he did it, and he still has those fantastic rankings today, thanks to doing things the Site Build It! way.
Bear in mind, the subjects Rupert chose. These weren't picked by chance. If you have ambitions in a very competitive sector, the search-engine-based SBI! method will struggle. (You'll probably need to try and gain credibility through association, joint venture and build your own lists - but that's another story.)
AllanGardyne wrote:
Start by building a simple site that works - one that ranks well and earns revenue. Perhaps one day you'll want to go on and learn about cgi and php and Javascript. On the other hand, you might just decide you'd rather carry on building simple, profitable web sites
Couldn't agree more. If you don't have specific reasons for using server-side scripting, why go to the trouble of learning to "play" with it in the first place. Stick with SBI!
Sorry if this has got a bit wordy, but "doing it my way" is a big part of the "internet dream" for me. Isn't it for you too?
Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 2:39 pm Post subject: Re: Do it by the book, or don't do it at all...
Charlie wrote:
Sorry if this has got a bit wordy, but "doing it my way" is a big part of the "internet dream" for me. Isn't it for you too?
Absolutely Charlie, doing it my way at the beginning I had to learn html just as you said, SEO, scripting, and a ton of other stuff ... but now, doing it my way means I can focus on doing what I love ... and that is writing and providing quality content that means something and helps people.
With SBI, I get good rankings, visitors that get the answers they need, and still make money ... with a lot less work ... for me, SBI is a no-brainer but I also realize it isn't for everyone.
The great thing about boards like this is being able to see what everyone is doing, and what they think, then making an educated decision that's best for you.
Debs _________________ Learn how to turn keyphrases into quality, well-targeted articles your visitors and SE's will love with Gary Antosh's new ebook "Web Content Made Easy!"
Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 6:31 pm Post subject: Freedom to choose
Debs wrote:
Absolutely Charlie, doing it my way at the beginning I had to learn html just as you said, SEO, scripting, and a ton of other stuff ... but now, doing it my way means I can focus on doing what I love ... and that is writing and providing quality content that means something and helps people.
For some people, maybe html is all part of the fun!
Debs wrote:
The great thing about boards like this is being able to see what everyone is doing, and what they think, then making an educated decision that's best for you.
I know SBI isn't for everyone. It may not even be for me, but I believe I at least have to give it a go.
SBI seems to offer a lot of help, and being a newbie I need to take all the help I can get!
Obviously I can't say if SBI is for me or not until I have tried it. It may make my life a lot easier but then again I may thrive on building my own website.
I believe learning html etc will be the way for me to go in the future, but for now I really think SBI is my way ahead.
Sorry if this has got a bit wordy, but "doing it my way" is a big part of the "internet dream" for me. Isn't it for you too? -
So true Charlie. That is the dream - freedom to do what you want. The money wouldn't be turned down but it is the freedom that I crave.
Thanks for all your advice.
I don't want to get all slushy but this really is the most helpful forum I have come across.
PHP is a coding language which lends itself well to dynamic websites....
...
SSI is server side includes...
...
CGI is a programming language...
Maybe I'm a bit too much of a Floccinaucinihilipilificatrix here, but:
SSI is indeed "server side includes" - small pieces of special code that the server replaces with certain data before sending the page over to the visitor. One of the most practical uses for SSI is what Debs referred to - you can make a text file with content common to all (or some) of your pages, and add a ssi code to the page that tells the server to insert that text file on all pages. There are other useful ssi codes too, such as data and time stamps.
CGI isn't a program, but rather any program that allows for dynamically created web pages (that is web pages that are created as and when requested). PHP is one such CGI program - and the most popular today it seems. Others include perl (PHP's "grandfather"), ColdFusion, WebDNA (specially targeted online stores) etc. _________________ Frank Nordberg
http://www.musicaviva.com
The internet center for free sheet music
CGI isn't a program, but rather any program that allows for dynamically created web pages
Thanks for the clarification, I knew I got too simplistic with that one to the point of err.
Debs _________________ Learn how to turn keyphrases into quality, well-targeted articles your visitors and SE's will love with Gary Antosh's new ebook "Web Content Made Easy!"
Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2003 8:13 am Post subject: PHP vs CGI... if anyone cares
Hello all.
Frank Nordberg wrote:
One of the most practical uses for SSI is what Debs referred to - you can make a text file with content common to all (or some) of your pages, and add a ssi code to the page that tells the server to insert that text file on all pages.
Just as a side note, SBI! can actually achieve much the same thing using it's site-wide template model.
Frank Nordberg wrote:
CGI isn't a program, but rather any program that allows for dynamically created web pages (that is web pages that are created as and when requested). PHP is one such CGI program - and the most popular today it seems.
Just to clarify... if anyone cares...
Common Gateway Interface (CGI) is a protocol not a programming language. It's how servers talk to programs they interact with. Any script that sends or receives information to/from a server needs to follow the CGI protocol.
When people talk about CGI scripts, they mean scripts (often, but not always written in Perl) that follow the CGI protocol.
Sorry if I'm beginning to sound like a techie!
PHP, on the other hand, is a server-side, HTML-embedded scripted language.
Although you can achieve much the same with PHP as you can with CGI scripts, it's done in a different way...
PHP code can be actually embedded within the HTML code on a web page. This gets around much of the "fun" associated with installing CGI scripts, and has helped lead to a surge in popularity for PHP in recent years, as Frank mentioned. Basically, PHP is slightly simpler for non-techies.
Note PHP is a scripting language, whereas Perl is a programming language that can also be used for scripts!
Joined: 02 Jul 2003 Posts: 5839 Location: by the beach, Australia
Posted: Sat Aug 23, 2003 2:22 am Post subject:
Relax, Kathy. It's possible to make a good living online without ever learning CGI or php, or any of the rest of the alphabet soup, just the same way most of us drive a car without understanding how an internal combustion engine works.
Yanik Silver, a very clever Internet marketer, once said he hasn't even learned how to use HTML. He concentrates on words that sell and lets someone else create his sites.
It's your choice. You can get involved in this stuff as little or as much as you like.
For example, when I decided to revamp this forum recently, I didn't even do the research myself. I asked a guy I trust to investigate what he thought were the best options and give me recommendations. Then I asked him to set it up for me.
I probably could have done it myself, but it's not something I'm interested in, so I don't do it. I'd rather spend time writing than learning techie stuff.
It is very useful, however, to learn basic HTML so that you can make simple changes yourself instead of relying on someone else.
Posted: Sat Aug 23, 2003 11:46 am Post subject: There's "more than one way to skin a cat"...
Hello Kathy.
Allan Gardyne wrote:
Yanik Silver, a very clever Internet marketer, once said he hasn't even learned how to use HTML. He concentrates on words that sell and lets someone else create his sites.
I think it's only fair to say that Yanik doesn't use anything like the standard SBI! model of content site relying on the search engines. He uses the direct marketing approach, a very strong affiliate program and more than a splash of viral marketing to promote his own range of products to online marketing wannabees. (Selling tools to gold miners, as is Ken Evoy.)
There are several ways to build an online empire, other than using SBI!
Quote:
It's your choice. You can get involved in this stuff as little or as much as you like.
If you use SBI! your choice is restricted. Whether you should be bothering with scripts and such is a good question, but the fact remains that the option to choose will be taken from you.
But Allan's right, Kathy, you don't NEED much techie knowledge if any.
Cheers,
Charlie. _________________ "Before I speak, I have something important to say."
- Groucho Marx
Robert Heinlein's definition: "Someone so sharp he or she spots the slightest flaw."
(Actually, OED's definition is slightly different, but Heinlein's definition has kind o' struck the heart of people all over the world.)
But back to topic:
I'd say the answer to what's the best way to make a site is: use whatever tools that fits the task and your working methods best. There is no definite answer.
But be a bit wary of FrontPage. It seems to have a tendency to create web sites that only Internet Explorer can make sense out of.
Despite Microsoft's frantic attempts to monopolize the internet, more and more Windows users are swithching to Mozilla these days, there are still some people who are clinging to their own Netscape or Opera browsers, "experts" estimate that ten percent of the web surfers will use Konqueror/Safari before soon, and on, and so on...
It doesn't matter much what tools you use, but unless the end result the visitor's browser sees isn't plain html (if necessary with some ssi and JavaScript thrown in) you risk loosing quite a significant percentage of your potential customers. _________________ Frank Nordberg
http://www.musicaviva.com
The internet center for free sheet music
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But these days, it seems as though it's only the SBI! tail that wags the SiteSell dog! 
but this really is the most helpful forum I have come across.
